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Post by topbilled on Apr 7, 2024 20:39:01 GMT
This was a great pick, AndreaDoria. Thank you.
Four Daughters moves me more than Young at Heart (1954) with Doris Day and Frank Sinatra. Do you think it works better with Mickey/Barney dying? Or with him surviving the accident?
Sinatra refused to have him be killed off in the remake.
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Post by topbilled on Apr 7, 2024 20:40:48 GMT
I don't think Rains deserved a nod for this film...he doesn't have very many dramatic moments to play. Garfield gave a beautiful performance and deserved his nomination. Oh no, I know....I am just teasing for my love of Claude. The old Dad bit was a touch painful at points.
It seems like Jules might haven been a moody Brando ahead of his time...
(Screenwriter Julius J. Epstein on John Garfield) Garfield was a nice guy, but kind of a sad sack. We'd tease him. There was something called The Writers' Table, where writers sat around at lunch in the commissary, and I remember Garield coming up once and saying, 'Let's have an intellectual discussion.' I said, 'Sure, who's going to represent you?' Interesting quote. Yes, Garfield was an early method actor...so comparing him to Brando makes sense.
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Post by galacticgirrrl on Apr 7, 2024 20:44:25 GMT
Well I wouldn't use the word fun exactly - more disasters in the romance department I'm not sure I've ever witnessed - but I thoroughly enjoyed it and all the fabulous music.
And of course the great company.
My internet was terrible - lucky for all of you - no need for you to hear about all the on-screen kitchen accoutrements that I own, including meat grinder. Not much 3D printing needed in this one.
Thank you Andrea Doria et al.
Until we High Hosey again next week....I bid you adieu.
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Post by BunnyWhit on Apr 7, 2024 20:46:19 GMT
This was a great pick, AndreaDoria. Thank you.
Four Daughters moves me more than Young at Heart (1954) with Doris Day and Frank Sinatra. Do you think it works better with Mickey/Barney dying? Or with him surviving the accident?
Sinatra refused to have him be killed off in the remake. I think Sinatra's not dying is part of why I like that film less than this one. Mickey has to die. It is the only way he can give. He's spent his life taking, expecting, hurting others for his gain. The only way we can see that his character has grown and changed....to see that he is actually capable of giving....is to see him make the ultimate sacrifice. Dietz gives Mickey the money and says, "Use it for whatever you think will make Ann happy." It is then that we see him realize that the only way to make her happy is to "give" her back to Dietz, and the only way to do that is to sacrifice himself.
A Mickey who lives might change for a time, but I don't know that I believe it would last. That's how I've always felt about Barney. I don't think it will last, and he'll make Laurie miserable for the rest of her life.
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Post by Andrea Doria on Apr 7, 2024 20:46:27 GMT
Whether it's Frank Sinatra or John Garfield, I alternate between loving Mickey and wanting Cher to step up and slap him, saying "Snap out of it!"
I love this movie though. So many great lines, but I think my favorites are Aunt Etta's.
ETA: I agree BunnyWhit! It's mickey's only good story arc, plus no one wanted to see Priscilla's character have to live her whole life in misery.
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Post by galacticgirrrl on Apr 7, 2024 20:47:24 GMT
This was a great pick, AndreaDoria. Thank you.
Four Daughters moves me more than Young at Heart (1954) with Doris Day and Frank Sinatra. Do you think it works better with Mickey/Barney dying? Or with him surviving the accident?
Sinatra refused to have him be killed off in the remake. I'm going to have to think about that one. I am still in shock over life just carrying on so quickly without him.
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Post by topbilled on Apr 7, 2024 20:58:43 GMT
Do you think it works better with Mickey/Barney dying? Or with him surviving the accident?
Sinatra refused to have him be killed off in the remake. I think Sinatra's not dying is part of why I like that film less than this one. Mickey has to die. It is the only way he can give. He's spent his life taking, expecting, hurting others for his gain. The only way we can see that his character has grown and changed....to see that he is actually capable of giving....is to see him make the ultimate sacrifice. Dietz gives Mickey the money and says, "Use it for whatever you think will make Ann happy." It is then that we see him realize that the only way to make her happy is to "give" her back to Dietz, and the only way to do that is to sacrifice himself.
A Mickey who lives might change for a time, but I don't know that I believe it would last. That's how I've always felt about Barney. I don't think it will last, and he'll make Laurie miserable for the rest of her life.
Good points. Also, Sinatra insisting the character live, meant there would be no sequel...since FOUR WIVES is about Ann getting over Mickey's death.
Sinatra earned an Oscar for a death scene in FROM HERE TO ETERNITY...wonder why he was so opposed to doing a death scene in YOUNG AT HEART.
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Post by kims on Apr 7, 2024 21:08:10 GMT
Robert Osborne in his intro to the film said Sinatra didn't want to make a habit of dying in all his films. The two previous films he made, including FROM HERE TO ETERNITY, Sinatra's character dies.
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Post by BunnyWhit on Apr 7, 2024 21:16:39 GMT
I think Sinatra's not dying is part of why I like that film less than this one. Mickey has to die. It is the only way he can give. He's spent his life taking, expecting, hurting others for his gain. The only way we can see that his character has grown and changed....to see that he is actually capable of giving....is to see him make the ultimate sacrifice. Dietz gives Mickey the money and says, "Use it for whatever you think will make Ann happy." It is then that we see him realize that the only way to make her happy is to "give" her back to Dietz, and the only way to do that is to sacrifice himself.
A Mickey who lives might change for a time, but I don't know that I believe it would last. That's how I've always felt about Barney. I don't think it will last, and he'll make Laurie miserable for the rest of her life.
Good points. Also, Sinatra insisting the character live, meant there would be no sequel...since FOUR WIVES is about Ann getting over Mickey's death.
Sinatra earned an Oscar for a death scene in FROM HERE TO ETERNITY...wonder why he was so opposed to doing a death scene in YOUNG AT HEART. Great point. I wonder if it was part of his power trip on the film. His recording of the title tune, "Young at Heart", was such a smash hit that it gave the film it's name. He also was responsible for changing the director of photography, getting Day's husband banned from the set. Maybe by that point he felt it was appropriate to change the outcome of the entire story......which is exactly the sort of move Mickey/Barney would make.
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Post by topbilled on Apr 7, 2024 21:16:58 GMT
If this story was remade by a film studio now, here is how I think it would be structured...
If the four daughters were still caucasian:
One daughter would end up with a white male husband the same age as her...this would be the traditional conservative couple.
One daughter would end up with a male husband outside her race.
One daughter would be lesbian and end up with a wife.
One daughter would have a long-term boyfriend she does not marry (because he already has a wife he cannot divorce) and she has a kid by him.
Also I think the aunt character would have to be fleshed out more. She could have been a woman who was jilted on her wedding day and never got over it. Or she was a woman who had tried to become a nun but was not successful at keeping her vows. She would have a troubled past.
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Post by topbilled on Apr 7, 2024 21:56:26 GMT
Thank you Andrea for doing a nice job kicking off this month's theme.
I am not going to individually review FOUR DAUGHTERS, FOUR WIVES or FOUR MOTHERS. But will wait till the end of the third week to offer commentary/overview of all three films together.
Looking ahead at the cast lists, I am pleased to see that Vera Lewis appears as Mrs. Ridgefield in all three films. I wonder if Mrs. Ridgefield gets found out for being a closeted gate swinger, and if so, does she end up snubbed for it by the other haughty women in the community? Maybe the shame causes her to sneak some cooking sherry and develop a drinking problem. Also, I am eager to find out if she made the Lemps pay for that broken plate. Or did she forgive them because their front gate brought so much joy into her life...?
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Post by topbilled on Apr 8, 2024 0:29:41 GMT
There is a collection that was issued by Warner Brothers:
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Post by Fading Fast on Apr 8, 2024 18:04:10 GMT
Four Daughters from 1938 with Priscilla Lane, John Garfield, Claude Rains, May Robson, Jeffrey Lynn, Rosemary Lane, Lola Lane, Gale Page, Dick Foran and Frank McHugh
Some movies have so many characters and such fast-paced, smart dialogue that you can only really appreciate them the second or third time you see them, when you are no longer focused on getting the names down and the plot straight.
Four Daughters, with its interesting characters and sharp, snappy dialogue, is that type of movie. Its story, really several stories, is romantic, charming, sad and heartbreaking all at once, just as life is in any large family like "the Lemps."
The Lemp family - get ready for it - has four early adult daughters, played by the three real-life Lane sisters Priscilla, Rosemary and Lola and Gale Page, plus a widowed father played by Claude Rains and a spinster aunt played by May Robson.
The male suitors—the bane of any father with pretty daughters - comprise Frank McHugh, Jeffrey Lynn, Dick Foran, and John Garfield. Garfield, here, won a Best Supporting Actor Academy Award playing a rebellious young man, a persona that defined his career.
The Lemps are musical. Rains is the dean of music at the local college and the girls either sing or play instruments with Rains conducting his family "orchestra" for fun. It's a spirited, happy and busy household, but change is coming as the girls are thinking of marriage.
There are several relationships in play. Foran, the local florist, is trying to court Page, who is interested in Lynn, who has eyes for Priscilla. Practical Lola is considering a proposal from wealthy McHugh, whom she likes but doesn't love - his money keeps him in the running.
It's humming along with all the ups and downs you'd expect until Tolstoy's "a stranger comes to town" in the form of a handsome and surely pianist, played by John Garfield. He's there to help Lynn with his composition work, but he quickly garners the attention of Priscilla.
Garfield is angry at the world, or "the fates" as he calls them, because of his hard upbringing as an orphan and, as he sees it, his talent being shy of genius, which leaves him frustrated and poor. One could easily argue Garfield's bitterness self sabotages his success.
The happy Lemp home is both appealing and irritating to Garfield. It reminds him of what he never had, but since the Lemps embrace him, he can't help liking it too. It's Priscilla, though, who takes on "making him human" as a project, which sets up the movie's central conflict.
Priscilla and Lynn were on a glidepath to engagement and marriage, until Garfield takes Priscilla out of her comfort zone. Whom she marries, what happens to both men as a result and how her marriage develops is the climax of this engaging melodrama.
It works because the writing is sharp, fast and funny. You will need to see it several times to take in all the lines, such as when Rains playfully threatens to go down to City Hall to have his name removed from his daughters' birth certificates because they like "modern" music.
It also works because the acting talent is excellent. Yes, Garfield earned his Oscar, but each daughter, even the ones with the smaller roles, creates a believable and nuanced character. May Robson all but steals scenes as the lovable aunt.
Jeffrey Lynn gives one of his best performances as the charming and handsome musician who looks like life has always fallen nicely into place for him until Garfield catches Priscilla's eye. Rains is outstanding as the ringmaster of all this who knows he really controls nothing.
Finally, it works because it's charming, but not cloying. The Lemps are lovable but believable. You wish you could spend time with them, but their problems are real and they take some painful body blows along the way. There's a reason they made two sequels.
Director Michael Curtiz professionally moved his large cast through this busy story. Almost every scene is poignant, with transitions flowing so seamlessly they barely register. Even the obvious sets add to the charm, without tipping the movie into mawkishness.
Four Daughters is so well done you can only fully appreciate its seemingly "simple story" with multiple viewings. That's when you'll both catch the numerous smart lines you missed the first time through and pick up the many relationship nuances that flew by too fast.
With all the cultural change since 1938, for some, the focus on marriage in Four Daughters could make it irrelevant. But the well-developed characters of the young women still provide a window into the past and insight into dating and relationships, even today.
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Post by Andrea Doria on Apr 8, 2024 18:46:03 GMT
Thanks for bringing it all back in an entertaining, organized fashion, Fading Fast!
Since Topbilled mentioned he had a few favorite movies he watched over and over, I've been looking for one like that myself, something comforting I can watch when I can't sleep, this may be it for me!
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Post by Fading Fast on Apr 8, 2024 19:16:01 GMT
Thanks for bringing it all back in an entertaining, organized fashion, Fading Fast!
Since Topbilled mentioned he had a few favorite movies he watched over and over, I've been looking for one like that myself, something comforting I can watch when I can't sleep, this may be it for me! Thank you for your kind words. I found it a bit hard to distill my thoughts down to a coherent review. If I felt I wasn't already pushing my word limit, I would have discussed the girls' interactions with each other more, which I loved.
This is, I think, the third time I've seen it in, probably, three decades, but I now want to watch it again, as soon as tomorrow if I could. Maybe it was sharing it the way we did, or the age and place that I'm at in my life now, but more than before, I loved it and saw a lot to appreciate in the Lemp family and the daughters' travails and also love for each other. Plus I love that big old house and the classic American wardrobes.
I know I will be watching it again soon. I'm glad you feel the same way.
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