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Post by Newbie on Jan 13, 2023 15:58:09 GMT
Fonzie literally jumped a shark, but are there other tv characters who drastically changed during the show's run? It could be for the better or worse.
Here's a couple I thought of:
Bailey Quarters in WKRP went from terribly shy to more of an assertive women's liberation type. She even looked a bit like Gloria Steinem with the long hair and glasses.
Daphne on Frasier went from an adorable, kook with questionable psychic powers to a harsh, humorless nag.
Fonzie went from minor character, troubled youth to cool leather jacket-wearing star of the show.
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Post by topbilled on Jan 13, 2023 16:37:42 GMT
Great topic.
On Family Matters Jaleel White started on a recurring basis playing annoying but cute neighbor Steve Urkel. But he became the show's breakout star, and as things went on, Urkel became even more annoying to the point of obnoxious in some episodes...yet we were still supposed to find him endearing and root for him to marry Laura (Kelly Shanygne Williams).
On Dallas Linda Gray's Sue Ellen went from quiet wife in the first season to victimized and alcoholic. Her train wreck of a life and fiery passions provided a lot of drama in subsequent seasons. By the end of her run, she had become a self-assured business woman and played a nasty trick on ex-husband J.R. (Larry Hagman) right before she left town.
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Post by Newbie on Jan 13, 2023 17:55:48 GMT
Thanks, TopBilled.
Urkel, like Fonzie, became the star of the show complete with catch phrases. And like Happy Days' Chuck Cunningham, Family Matters dumped an extra sibling, Judy Winslow. Both characters went up to their rooms never to be seen from again.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2023 23:41:23 GMT
This is a low quality video but still a favorite. The original Baily Quarters before she lost the eye wear.
I have not seen the show since it was on TV originally. This is the change in format scene. It is said Dr. Johnny Fever broke the microphone assembly more than once while filming. A trained eye will notice the tone arm on the turntable on the air, has no stylus, as it ends up in the center of the record. I've been trying to locate the episode where Bailey gets stoned and sings the Nestle commercial. I seem to recall Bailey went to bland and boring to exciting and attractive from season one to season two. The turntables went from larger than and LP to the same size as an LP, but they are not characters. A very realistic moment is when Johnny can get a cart to go into the machine. He turns off the microphone, slaps the cartridge into place and turns his mic back on. Well, a little too much information for the thread. Enjoy the video.
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Post by Newbie on Jan 14, 2023 0:31:43 GMT
This is a low quality video but still a favorite. The original Baily Quarters before she lost the eye wear.
I have not seen the show since it was on TV originally. This is the change in format scene. It is said Dr. Johnny Fever broke the microphone assembly more than once while filming. A trained eye will notice the tone arm on the turntable on the air, has no stylus, as it ends up in the center of the record. I've been trying to locate the episode where Bailey gets stoned and sings the Nestle commercial. I seem to recall Bailey went to bland and boring to exciting and attractive from season one to season two. The turntables went from larger than and LP to the same size as an LP, but they are not characters. A very realistic moment is when Johnny can get a cart to go into the machine. He turns off the microphone, slaps the cartridge into place and turns his mic back on. Well, a little too much information for the thread. Enjoy the video.
Well, jimimac71 sounds like you know what your talking about. Did you work at a radio station or just knowledgeable about the equipment? I don't remember Bailey getting stoned but I do remember that Johnny brought brownies, wink-wink, to the Christmas party. Everyone but Carlson avoided those brownies. Arthur later had a nutty dream where he was visited by three ghosts.
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Post by UI_optimizer on Jan 14, 2023 0:48:29 GMT
Did Archie Bunker ever become "enlightened", either on the original series or on Archie's Place? I was too young to understand much of his original persona, and after my parents moved away from the show, I never went back myself.
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Post by galacticgirrrl on Jan 14, 2023 1:10:40 GMT
Two that spring to mind for me...and I'm painting with a bit broader stroke, but please indulge me....
Mannix The Season 1 detective and the show is so unusual. What a shame Lucille Ball and producer Bruce Geller changed it to a 'regular' detective show. If viewership was down I guess this is to be expected. I still enjoyed Mannix 2.0.
During the first season of the series, Joe Mannix works for a large Los Angeles detective agency called Intertect, which was the planned original title of the show. His superior is Lew Wickersham, played by Joseph Campanella. Intertect uses computers to help solve crimes.
As opposed to the other employees, Mannix belonged to the classic American detective archetype, thus he usually ignores the computers' solutions, disobeys his boss's orders, and sets out to do things his own way. He wears plaid sport coats and has his own office that he keeps sloppy between his assignments. Lew has cameras in all the rooms of the Intertect offices monitoring the performance of his employees and providing instant feedback through intercoms in the room. Unlike the other Intertect operatives, Mannix attempts to block the camera with a coat rack and questions Lew, comparing him to Big Brother.
Lost in Space I never watched this program. It was far too silly for my tastes. I didn't understand the robot or Dr. Smith. And then I saw the lost pilot - No Place to Hide. What an opening! Even though it gets a bit silly in parts (like the washing machine segment) it still made me wonder what could have been.
The episode portrayed the entire crew as intellectually gifted or accomplished: both John and Maureen Robinson had doctoral degrees, their children were prodigies, and Don West was identified as a doctor of geology. The pilot did not include later series regulars Dr. Zachary Smith or the Robot.
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Post by jinsinna13 on Jan 14, 2023 14:32:44 GMT
Thanks, TopBilled. Urkel, like Fonzie, became the star of the show complete with catch phrases. And like Happy Days' Chuck Cunningham, Family Matters dumped an extra sibling, Judy Winslow. Both characters went up to their rooms never to be seen from again. This also happened, to a certain extent, to eldest son Mike Douglas (played by Tim Considine) on My Three Sons. After Ernie (played by Barry Livingston) is adopted, Robbie (played by Don Grady) is now the oldest, and Mike is barely mentioned again.
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Post by jinsinna13 on Jan 14, 2023 14:35:51 GMT
Bailey Quarters in WKRP went from terribly shy to more of an assertive women's liberation type. She even looked a bit like Gloria Steinem with the long hair and glasses. Bailey's environmentalism and women's liberation causes are taken directly from Jan Smithers (Bailey) herself, and this gave Bailey more depth as the show went on.
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Post by jinsinna13 on Jan 14, 2023 14:46:03 GMT
Homer Simpson on The Simpsons was never a genius, but he becomes dumber as the show goes on. The same thing happens to Joey Tribbiani on Friends, Eric Matthews on Boy Meets World, and Peter on The Monkees.
Dr. Zachary Smith on Lost in Space was introduced as a scheming villian, but he became overly dramatic and screamed like a girl every week.
Ned Flanders on The Simpsons was introduced as a kind-hearted neighbor and family man who was religious. As the show goes on, however, the religious part of his personality becomes overly exaggerated. Hence why Flanderization is named after Ned Flanders.
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Post by Newbie on Jan 14, 2023 15:22:51 GMT
Two that spring to mind for me...and I'm painting with a bit broader stroke, but please indulge me.... MannixThe Season 1 detective and the show is so unusual. What a shame Lucille Ball and producer Bruce Geller changed it to a 'regular' detective show. If viewership was down I guess this is to be expected. I still enjoyed Mannix 2.0. During the first season of the series, Joe Mannix works for a large Los Angeles detective agency called Intertect, which was the planned original title of the show. His superior is Lew Wickersham, played by Joseph Campanella. Intertect uses computers to help solve crimes.
As opposed to the other employees, Mannix belonged to the classic American detective archetype, thus he usually ignores the computers' solutions, disobeys his boss's orders, and sets out to do things his own way. He wears plaid sport coats and has his own office that he keeps sloppy between his assignments. Lew has cameras in all the rooms of the Intertect offices monitoring the performance of his employees and providing instant feedback through intercoms in the room. Unlike the other Intertect operatives, Mannix attempts to block the camera with a coat rack and questions Lew, comparing him to Big Brother. Lost in SpaceI never watched this program. It was far too silly for my tastes. I didn't understand the robot or Dr. Smith. And then I saw the lost pilot - No Place to Hide. What an opening! Even though it gets a bit silly in parts (like the washing machine segment) it still made me wonder what could have been. The episode portrayed the entire crew as intellectually gifted or accomplished: both John and Maureen Robinson had doctoral degrees, their children were prodigies, and Don West was identified as a doctor of geology. The pilot did not include later series regulars Dr. Zachary Smith or the Robot.I like where you took this topic, galacticgirrrl. Great examples of shows that changed drastically. There must be other examples. Wonder Woman with Lynda Carter started out in the 1940s but in later seasons shifted the story to modern (1970s) times.
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Post by Newbie on Jan 14, 2023 15:27:41 GMT
Thanks, TopBilled. Urkel, like Fonzie, became the star of the show complete with catch phrases. And like Happy Days' Chuck Cunningham, Family Matters dumped an extra sibling, Judy Winslow. Both characters went up to their rooms never to be seen from again. This also happened, to a certain extent, to eldest son Mike Douglas (played by Tim Considine) on My Three Sons. After Ernie (played by Barry Livingston) is adopted, Robbie (played by Don Grady) is now the oldest, and Mike is barely mentioned again.Another great example. Did they even mention Mike in the later seasons? I don't think so. I remember Robbie starting out as kind of a goofy middle kid, like Bud on Father Knows Best, but then morphed into serious oldest brother in later seasons.
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Post by Newbie on Jan 14, 2023 15:34:18 GMT
Homer Simpson is another good example, jinsinna13. The show, which is still on after 34 seasons, has made him so incredibly stupid it's unwatchable. Lisa, too. She used to be a smart little kid who also watched Itchy and Scratchy with Bart. She is now an insufferable, sanctimonious know it all.
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Post by topbilled on Jan 14, 2023 17:39:30 GMT
The character that I think changed the most dramatically was Abby Dalton's character Julia Cumson on the long-running Falcon Crest. I always credit her with the being the actress who showed the most range in any continuous program, because the writers threw everything at her and she mastered it all. It really has to have been the most challenging role ever on a TV series.
Season 1...Julia was a businesswoman living in the shadows of her mother Angela (Jane Wyman) and had a drinking problem.
Season 2...someone was trying to kill her, only we found out she was staging those accidents and she was covering up a murder she committed. The season 2 cliffhanger saw her cornered by police. She pulled out a gun and started firing. She ended up claiming another victim, played by Lana Turner.
Season 3...she is arrested and convicted and sent to prison. She gets beaten up in prison, in what was a horrific prison abuse storyline then eventually escaped. She is in hiding for the second half of season 3 having an unlikely romance with a character played by Geoffrey Lewis. She is found out and cornered once again by police. Only this time she has kidnapped her little grandson and mother (Wyman). There is a standoff inside a cabin, a lantern is knocked over and the place catches on fire. She is presumed dead.
Season 4...she is still alive and in what became her most sinister plot, she hooked up with a neo-Nazi (played by Paul Freeman). She managed to keep evading justice.
Season 5...change of writers, things settled down a bit for her. She was no longer as evil, after she served some time and was officially released back into her mother's custody. It turned out she had an illegitimate son (Ken Olin) who was a priest. There was an earthquake at the end of this season and her life was in danger again.
Season 6...she had become blind in the earthquake. So now Abby Dalton was playing her as having a physical disability. In the middle of the season, she left the valley and went to Oregon to join a convent!
So she went from powerful businesswoman to drunk to victim to murderer, to abused in prison, to fugitive, to kidnapper, to presumed dead, to neo-Nazi, to mother of a priest, to blind, to nun. Who else has played a killer that became a nun on a TV show and still managed to retain viewer sympathy?
The reason this worked is because Abby Dalton was a beautiful glamorous woman, because she was a skilled method actress, and because all her character's problems could be traced back to her controlling mother (Wyman). Their tricky relationship was intense, it was a classic case of sins of the mother being visited on the daughter, and the daughter becoming at times deranged and dangerous, before supposedly finding god. To this day, I don't know why Abby Dalton was never nominated for an Emmy. She had the most difficult role of anyone on television at that time, and never once did we hate Julia, we pitied her and we remained glued to the set because Abby Dalton always gave a magnetic performance.
She is the main reason to watch the show on home video. Seasons 1 through 4 are truly classic and Julia Cumson is TV's most intriguing and changeable character.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2023 18:36:19 GMT
This is a low quality video but still a favorite. The original Baily Quarters before she lost the eye wear.
I have not seen the show since it was on TV originally. This is the change in format scene. It is said Dr. Johnny Fever broke the microphone assembly more than once while filming. A trained eye will notice the tone arm on the turntable on the air, has no stylus, as it ends up in the center of the record. I've been trying to locate the episode where Bailey gets stoned and sings the Nestle commercial. I seem to recall Bailey went to bland and boring to exciting and attractive from season one to season two. The turntables went from larger than and LP to the same size as an LP, but they are not characters. A very realistic moment is when Johnny can get a cart to go into the machine. He turns off the microphone, slaps the cartridge into place and turns his mic back on. Well, a little too much information for the thread. Enjoy the video.
Well, jimimac71 sounds like you know what your talking about. Did you work at a radio station or just knowledgeable about the equipment? I don't remember Bailey getting stoned but I do remember that Johnny brought brownies, wink-wink, to the Christmas party. Everyone but Carlson avoided those brownies. Arthur later had a nutty dream where he was visited by three ghosts. I worked in radio a couple of times. I understand many things from the world of analog. I was born with sloppy eyesight so sports was a joke. I've loved music and eventually the radio stations playing the music for years. WKRP was pretty close in time to stations experimenting with CDs. You don't have to check the speed like with a turntable. I once picked up the wrong tone arm and the station went quiet. Oops! Most of the time, the songs were played from 45 singles. In my day, a record might have the same song on both sides. One in mono for AM radio and the other in stereo for FM. I think WKRP might have failed without the use of turntables and cartridge machines. I remember the episode where Johnny played a hit song for the first time. I'm scratching my mind, but think it was the Eagles.
EDIT:
Speaking of scratching, this video has an audio issue, at least for my ears, but here is Johnny going from Rock Around The Clock to The Eagles. (Yes, the turntable is spinning way too fast for an LP.)
The episode is as I remember it.
I love how the daughter's voice ends just in time for the vocal to begin. So cool.
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